Bombardier TWINDEXX Trains

[emilymainzer]

I wonder what the minimum height above rail is Martyn for existing bridges? New structures have to have a 4780mm clearance, and Bombardier build this train with a maximum height of 4631mm.

http://www.railway-technology.com/pr...e-deck-trains/

[Beeyar Wunby]

Yup, double decker trains are the future for long distance rail travel - except in the UK where they haven't cottoned on yet.

Give them 50 years and then maybe.......

[pre65]

Don't forget the split level units that Oliver Bullieid designed in 1949, and retired from service in 1971.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SR_Class_4DD

http://www.britishpathe.com/video/double-deck-train

[emilymainzer]

Yes Beeyar you are right it might take 50 years. Suitable I'm not sure if NSW govt has that much of million $. But in my opinion why they don't refurbish the existing trains with more comfy seats and a better ride rather than spending on these expensive trains.

[Beeyar Wunby]

Originally Posted by pre65

Don't forget the split level units that Oliver Bullieid designed in 1949, and retired from service in 1971.

Yes indeed, they were more forward thinking 60+ years ago than they are now.

But as usual with everything British they were aimed at the wrong market (commuters) and done on a shoestring..

Originally Posted by Wonkypedia

The 4DD was somewhat unsuccessful because the upper level compartments were cramped and poorly ventilated (the upper level windows could not be opened due to tight clearance). The compartments were pressure-ventilated but the equipment proved to be troublesome. Dwell times at stations were lengthened because of the increase in the number of passengers per door.

With significantly longer dwell times it's not really viable on intensive commuter routes, but fully plausible on long distance/high speed ones.

Long ago we should have issued an edict for a NEW guage - so that all new structures and enhancements/repairs to mainline routes are made a bit wider and alot taller.

Look at HS2. It will be mostly a brand new railway and they'll miss the chance !

Most other countries have double deckers, but as usual our pathetic politicians and leaders will let us be one of the last countries in the world to have them.

[wyvern]

No thankyou. Modern trains are already quite claustrophobic enough, thankyou.

[Beeyar Wunby]

Originally Posted by wyvern

No thankyou. Modern trains are already quite claustrophobic enough, thankyou.

500 passengers one one deck, or 500 passengers between two decks ?

There's probably an element of subjectiveness to claustrophobia, but what I'm suggesting would provide more room - and also more seats. That would seem to me to be LESS claustrophobic ?

Unless you like being squashed in like a sardine and standing for 3 hours ?

[pre65]

It would seem that true DD coaches are impossible with our current loading gauge.

And the split level experiment referred to earlier on BR (S) seemed to have incurred longer than desired stop times for passengers to embark/disembark.

[wyvern]

Originally Posted by Beeyar Wunby

500 passengers one one deck, or 500 passengers between two decks ?

Surely the commercial case for the trains is squeeezing more passengers in for the money?

If you can fill a train to full and standing you make more money from more fares on the train, so there's no motivation on TOCs or the DfT to pay for more trains.

Only public pressure will reduce the overcrowding on trains.

[Beeyar Wunby]

Originally Posted by wyvern

Surely the commercial case for the trains is squeeezing more passengers in for the money?

If you can fill a train to full and standing you make more money from more fares on the train, so there's no motivation on TOCs or the DfT to pay for more trains.

Only public pressure will reduce the overcrowding on trains.

I agree with the first part, but sadly I don't believe that the public will have the slightest effect on policy. Civil servants and Network Rail have 100% authority and 0% accountability.

From a personal viewpoint - my company went from 8-car peak trains to 12-car peak trains about a year ago.

Some of these are already so full that we have problems getting the doors closed. Passenger growth year-on-year is staggering.

Since we've just about reached the maximum lenth of trains possible, the only way is up !

And that is why I'm galled that the people responsible for rail transport (DfT, ORR & NR) haven't even begun to consider gauge enhancements.

I suspect that the bean-counters in their ivory towers don't have to travel by train.