GNER services to be 're-nationalised'?
 

http://www.mailonsunday.co.uk/pages/...page_id=3&ct=5

If I had my way, the entire system would be taken back into public ownership.

I agree Trev.

"Big Business" and the government are playing games with what is essentially a public transport system. I am not totally against some private involvement but the system we have at the moment isn't fair to the millions of people who rely on the railways.
John.

If the Tories wanted to privatise BR they should have kept it as one and sold off 65% to the stock market, 5.1% to the workers and the goverment keeping the remaining 29.9% to have effective control. The only bit of BR I would have totally privatised would have been the freight into two companies, one run by EWS and the other by Freightliner. There would also be a open access so companies like West Coast Railways could operate charter trains and GBRf run frieght trains.

I agree, although it would mean less livery variety for modern image enthusiasts. :p

I'm with Trev on this, the railways should belong to the public of the nation, and be held in the custody of the nations government.

Adam

Although I agree with the above sentiments, I feel it's a bit of a shame as GNER is pretty much the only TOC I've ever used that has impressed.

I agree.

I'm a bit of an old socialist where this is concerned Adam. I don't want to turn this thread all political, but it seems to me that there are certain things which have a national importance and which should not be left in the hands of private, profit chasing companies.

In both World Wars, the railway system was requisitioned (well, sort of), it being recognised that there was a greater need, over and above that of delivering profits for private shareholders. Seems to me that the same should apply in peacetime.

Let's not forget the instant millionaires that were created when the Rosco's were sold on. In any other walk of life, that would be called 'theft'. :mad:

I too think that GNER run a good service, the problem with taking this out of the hands of private companies is that there would be no competition and no choice. And would services be improved? GNER refurbished the Mk4's, would that have happened if it was nationalised? But the private companies have to pass everything with the government anyway so they don't really have that much control.

GNER are generally regarded as one of the better TOC's. Helped, no doubt (at the time of privatisation), by inheriting the most recently modernised and electrified mainline and the newest locos and rolling-stock. Refurbishing the Mk4's was the least they could do.;)
John.

Good point John.

This is undoubtedly true and I almost said it myself in my earlier post. The reason I didn't was that even taking this into consideration in my experience they were still about the best

IMHO, YMMV

I worked in the Railway industry for 20 years both for BR and private TOC's.....I was a union rep at the time of privatisation......to me privatisation was a good way to go....The only problems that have arisen as a result are....Railtrack (now thankfully gone!)......A complete lack of high quality bidders for franchises (toc's)......A waste of resources on legal bods and engineering firms that charged way over the odds for work (now finished and in-house)......And finally rolling stock in good servicable condition being withdrawn prematurely (class 56/60/58/87/90 and HST's)....Aside from that there are many ,many positives the biggest being that a bit less control from the ministry of cars....whoops! transport!.....There is a depressing lack of private enterprise spirit still though......There is a huge potential market for the risk takers in the railway but all the current bus companies want to sit on their hands and wait for government handouts! Very sad!

Thanks Zwicky.
It's good to get an insiders point of view.
John.

Problem is Treasury have a "dead hand" and starve rail of money. If no "privatisation" we would probably never have modern rolling stock (even if it is sourced from foreign builders). Other problem is "horizontal" rather than "vertical" privatisation. TOCs, Network Rail often working in isolation.

I don't think vertical or horizontal makes much difference......both have pro's and con's.....The problem lies in that ultimately the entire industry is still dependant on government financing.....Here's a bit of Rail regulation.......Network Rail goes to the Rail Regulator and requests a rise in track charges to enable it to maintain and improve the network - say 10% - The Rail Regulator says ok increase charges by 8% and make the nescessary savings somewhere.....Network Rail increases track access by 8% and then GNER or Beardy Rail..sorry Virgin goes to the Dept of Transport and requests the extra funding for the 8% increase......and guess what? The Dept of Transport pay up........because the 1992 Railways Act is a soveriegn piece of legislation passed by Her Majesty's Parliament.....So the Rail Regulator has the power, the Dept. of Transport begin to re-hate Railway's because of the drain on the Departments budget and the Passengers and Industry suffer........Only a true free market system will work........but what about those Branchlines!!!!!!!!!!

But doesnt all this mess originate from the EEC, and that they said "Thou shall separate the Rolling Stock companies from the Infrastructure", and the UK Govt was left to sort out the resulting mess.

Maybe it suited the political colour of the time. Maybe the current Govt is happy with the mess:- but I do remember "Good 'ol British Rail" and a bit of grafiti from the 1970s seen on East Croydon station which summed up the frustration of the commuter:-

When the train A.S.L.E.F.t the station,
N.U.R. waiting for a train.
Think before the next Election,
Brothers, STRIKE AGAIN !

I think all the railways should be nationalised again, at least there would not be so many companies involved in operating a charter. Present situation is ridiculous.