Virgin Trains.
 

Announced this morning - Virgin Trains have lost the contract to run the WCML to First Group. I don't know much about FG but Virgin says they will be in financial trouble after offering too much money for the franchise.
FG admitted they will probably have to make staff cuts and close some ticket office's --- has anyone an opinion on this subject?

I find this astonishing. Surely the contract terms include a commitment to maintaining the existing level of service, or improving it. Closing ticket offices is a reduction in service, isn't it? And how can they run the same number of trains with fewer staff?

The government minister for transport appeared on T.V.this morning and she has promised that there will be more trains, more seats available and a far better service all round and that our lives will be much the better for the change.
Have I missed something here? Is there an election due!!!

I quote Richard Branson in a news article this morning
In his blog, Sir Richard voiced fears that the amount FirstGroup paid will make the contract unprofitable, forcing the Government to take back ownership of the line. This is what happened with the East Coast Main line, when first GNER (in 2007) and then National Express (in 2009) were stripped of the contract after they could not afford to pay the Government £1.3bn for the right to run the service.

"[Our] achievements have counted for little – as this is the fourth time that we have been outbid in a rail tender," Sir Richard wrote. "On the past three occasions, the winning operator has come nowhere close to delivering their promised plans and revenue, and has let the public and country down dramatically.

"In the case of the East Coast Main line, both winners – GNER and National Express - over-promised in order to win the franchise and spectacularly ran into financial difficulties in trying to deliver their plans. The East Coast is still in Government ownership and its service is outdated and underinvested, costing passengers and the country dearly as a result.

"Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. When will the Department for Transport learn?

With the cost of rail travel set to rise above inflation yet again this form of transport will soon become the transport of the rich anyway!!! Boy are we in a mess!!!!
Regards
Phil

If you look back at the problems we had in the West country, especial around Bristol with overcrowding, late running and cancelled trains, heaven help the WCML. We had passenger strikes and the train crews did their best only to have all the complaints fall on deaf ears. It took threats from the government to get thing turned around, but it is still a poor service compared to that of BR's last days here.
As for their bus services, well it takes so long to do a 7 mile trip that workers who use the bus spend a full day every week just sitting on a bus travelling to and from work.

This situation was forecasted by the Rail Unions, but were laughed at.
The only people who made owt out of privatisation is the legal brigade.
I worked through 3 Rail companies in my time on the railways, and saw the devestation brought on by these companies, closure/sackings/bully boy tatics et al.
I have even been told that a worker was diciplined for wearing the wrong company uniform.
While the locomotives and rolling stock are branded in the last companies name in big red letters.
Bully boys still at large it seems.
Nothing changes.

Virgin Trains.
 

Politicans couldn't tell the truth if hell had them.

I thought wrongly that privatisations would take the railways out of the hands of politicians but not the case so here we go again with senseless decisions. Virgin have proved their worth as a company and stayed with West Coast through diffficilt times and invested in new trains. First Western have taken the 'Great' out of a once reliable company with bad punctuality and problems around Bristol etc as mentioned by a previous contributor. Perhaps it is a back door to nationalization by polititians repeating wrong decisions as Silver Fox Phil observes.

It angers me that the politicians put money first instead of the travelling public. Dont thet realise that when FG fail to deliver their promises that it will be the taxpayer that has to bail them out again. I would not blame Sir Richard Branson if he did not take them back and pulls out of the railways. 15 years he has been running them and in my opinion he has done a good job.

Alan

is it just me or is the railways in a mess a company can bid on a franchise on a idea that they can make so much money ruining it over a set time? well not knowing how many poor so and so's might still have a job next week nether mind in the years to use it and still have to pay the share holders there money.
oh no sorry the government can pay them with the subs and bailout that might happen in the end so is it not just a case of money going round in circles

thinking about it keeps people in work all the rolling stock will need a repaint and hornby can realise thier 125 under a different colour

would nationalization be a step forward or would it just make things worse?

So First Group have the franchise, they are in it for one reason only PROFIT they ain't in it to run a railway.
And some where along the road someone is going to get screwed and guess what friends it's us again the tax payer & travelling public................Yes you & me. :(

Me thinks the government have seen the pound signs a bit too much. We will just have to wait and see what happens and if it goes wrong some of our tax will go to picking up the bill.
Richard

Are there any countries in the World where this type of privatisation actually works successfully?

I do feel sorry for all the Virgin staff who have worked so hard over the last few years to make Virgin the top Franchise in the eyes of the travelling public. The Pendolinos and Voyagers might not be the best stock in the world to travel on but they were achieving the original intentions.
As Richard says it seems that money and not an ability to deliver is what it takes to win a franchise!

I still believe that privatisation was the worst thing that happened. Although as has been said Virgin do seem to have done a reasonable job.
I'll reserve judgement on FG until the first problems start to appear!

If First run the West Coast as well as they operate FGW, then the users of WC don't know what bad service levels they can look forward to in future. How are First going to introduce an extra 11 x 6 coach trains onto a railway which has already been declared full with very few extra paths available? Presumably freight will have to be routed away from the West coast lines.

In yesterday's Western Morning News - a Plymouth paper fears are express about cuts in bus services in rural areas run by First Bus. In the south west First bus have already vacated North Devon to Stagecoach and are handing over Services in Taunton too. Does this trend hint that First will shut up bus garages to keep increased rail liabilities running -Coast Route. This is the company that took over former GWR bus company Western national. Are bus services in Yeovil, York, Leeds, Halifax, Sheffield, Bradford, etc safe?

frist are shuting bus services all over uk as they have £1.3bilion debt befor the money for the west cost line is added to this i wonder if my bus fare will go up soon in licester to cover the cost

I did'nt realise that FG were that much in debt, but who knows how these large companies operate financially, a million pounds appears to be just a number!
FG made a statement on TV that they will re- introduce trains from Shrewsbury,and Blackpool to Euston, sounds good, but the spokesman then added, --- " we need to purchase new trains first, so they won't be ready until 2016!!!
I apologise for repeating my view's, but when will our government realise that we should look on our railways as a very efficient means to move people as do the governments of the rest of Europe, and not as a profit making business, it's not working.

I must admit I'm not a fan of anything Branson or Virgin, so I would tend to put his remarks down to sour grapes - but he has a point. First Group has bid so much for this franchise that it is difficult to see how they're going to make it work, let alone improve the existing service. Several contributors to this thread have hit the nail on the head: no privatised rail company cares for anything whatsoever except profit. I suspect First may milk the franchise for all it's worth for a few years, then claim it's bankrupting them and hand it back to the government. As long as we have this crazy system that lets private companies walk away from their franchises when it suits them, I'm not hopeful about things changing for the better.

First Group only know 2 things, make money and bully staff. I worked for FG and I've never felt so demorolised. If you keep hitting a dog with a stick, the dog will come back and bite. As for Virgin, everybody seems sad at its demise and it reminds me of that song about the the boy who could see King with no clothes on, everybody moaned like mad, (I wanted to say f*&k) at the end of the day Virgin was not that good in many respects. However one of my favorite records/cds/ downloads is Tubular Bells. I like the bit where it is the soundtrack in The Exorcist