They smell like one too.

I must say that you're right, a lot of the Northern stock has quite a pong to it. All of there 144s have the same musty smell to them, as do some of the 142s. I'd much rather have a nice TPE 185!

Its a shame that Northern are trying to hang on to their pacer classes and the 142 in particular simply cannot cope with passenger numbers on the modern railway.
They were designed at a time when passenger numbers were at their lowest and expected to keep on falling.
Now the railways are the busiest ever and we need something else.
I actually secretly quite like pacers as they have that colonel Stephens feel about them but there is a point when it gets too bad.
Earlier in the year I saw one still in merseyrail livery but the corner of the cab had been smashed in probably by an accident at the yard but it was still in service with a bit of masking tape holding the light in place. Surely that is beyond unsafe and should never have been shoved into service.
Their 158s often have bits falling off as those in other companies are refurbished.

If in hell there were a railway then it would be operated by Northern.
They should use that I think.

Just thinking about the Middlewich branch from Northwich.
This is a journey I would like to do if passenger services are reinstated but I do wish they would hurry up about it.
Mid cheshire rail users association want the line open to passengers. To be honset here I think they wouild do a grand job running it themselves as they have some good ideas and are actually interested in the passenger.
They could by a pacer off Northern for about 20p and do it up. Thats all they are worth by now.

Actually SFE, Northern lease their rolling stock, the Pacers are leased from Angel Trains according to my book. (Do I remember Angel Trains being taken over by a bank or somesuch?)

Regards, 62440.

Are those the ex First pacers?
I am pretty sure that the ex arriva ones are owned by Northern as Arriva managed to refurbish them with their won fittings.
So did Merseyrail and to a greater extent.

All of the class 142 vehicles are listed in the Platform 5 combined editions 2008, 2002, & 1998 as being owned by Angel Trains. I don't know of any (passenger) train operating company who actually "own" the rolling stock they use, all of it went to the three leasing companies at privatisation. All the class 143 and 144's are owned by Porterbrook except for about 6 or seven which are owned by various local authorities in South Wales. I don't know the lease details but presumably there would be scope for the operators to do "Re-furbs" to their own spec written into the agreements.

Regards, 62440.

Yes since Northern took over there haven't been any 158s or 175s on peak time services, unlike under First North Western.

In one of the Network Rail documents that's been produced it mentions it as a possible future proposal for between 2014 and 2019: http://www.networkrail.co.uk/browse%...st%20Urban.pdf

Yes a feasability report in the reopening of that line found the benefit:cost ratio is 5:1. Also if GMPTE looked at reopening Cheadle and Baguley stations then it should be feasible to run a Crewe-Altrincham-Manchester service, giving Northwich, Knutsford and Hale a half-hourly Manchester service.

Have to agree with this, travelled back from Gainsborough on Sunday, the pacer was in a disgraceful condition lights not working, the train was 40 minutes late, no information point on the station had to use my mobile to find out the delay, station was infested with rats running around on the platforms.

I shall be seeking compensation from Northern as the dalay caused me to miss a connecting train at Lincoln and I was over two hours late eventually. More people ought to use the complaint system,it looks bad on their performance data and they can be bought to book by the regulator - we put up with too much.